Re-organisation of Jolla company - Off-topic discussion

About desperation: Qt wish to enter and be a leader in that market and they need to do it using Linux (as kernel). Their desperation in seeking to lead that market - which is extremely competitive and therefore ROI are low compared to other markets - brought them to open a business with Jolla Oy.

Unfortunately, Jolla Oy has clearly no experience in embedded systems (the recovery/boot image has been provided by an italian more than a decade ago) nor about the Linux kernel (do dmesg on Xperia 10 II and everyone has some experience in the kernel area, will immediately gets the picture) nor about system/fleet/IoT management. Three fundamentals areas for automotive market.

Under this perspective, my offer to join Qt in order to put Jolla Oy in conditions of facing that market resulted in a flop because under their point of view, I was not able to lead the SFOS community, which worth nothing. It might worth nothing in absolute terms or it might be fundamental - but not for the automotive market, not for that business.

Unfortunately, one of the HR dogma/mantra is that the leadership is the key. False. The most nasty thing is that they believe in this mistake because HR = Human Resources which means that people will not accept to be treated like resources (natural resources to suck as much as possible) without a leader that encourage them to do things against their own interests.

Let me say, no one true leader will accept to allow their team people can be abused like a natural resource.

Even abusing natural resources is bad for the planet and for our footprint sustainability. Wrong concept - inherited from industrial revolution when factory jobs were based on a totally unskilled and untrained workforce, included children - about HR which leads to a chain of absurdities.

It is crazy, but fundamentally, Jolla Oy is driving into a bankruptcy because someone convinced people here in this forum that they are a community (which is false) and I was an enemy to fight what ever it takes. Politics always kills business. Amen.

My opinion, after all, is that everything has gone in the best way it could be. I would be not happy, if Qt would have accepted - rationally - to go with my proposal ignoring a community which was not even important for the automotive market.

Because Jolla Oy is too deeply involved into some politics games and nothing good can be done without freeing it from politics but to free it would cost a HUGE amount of money which would be a totally waste of resources.

The most important lesson that I have learned in the last three decades, is that winning or being the #1 is not as important as people usually think. Easy to say, but the hardest part is knowing what is a better alternative because everybody would say: I do not want to be a loser.

I know it, but it is trap based on a white-black vision bias to-win-or-not-to-win (cit. Shakespeare).

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They are not incompetent (*), they are sponsored and they need sponsorship because elections. You might call it bribing - sometimes it is bribing - but in most of the cases is just lobbying. Consider that in Europe, lobbying and bribing are riskily similar but in USA are two completely different things and lobbying is plain licit. Guess what? Many US software companies are from US.

The problem about office suite

The OpenOffice adoption in Europe because open-source is good makes no sense in a real-world, like the one depicted above. Not all public offices can have a IT specialist that provide assistance for OpenOffice, and OpenOffice does not came with an embedded cloud service, etc.

Moreover, many documents - for decades - have been written in a closed-source proprietary undocumented formats that OpenOffice cannot always open. This is not completely true but if OpenOffice does not open correctly a old .doc file, people complain while they do not complain if the same or worse result is achieved by Microsoft Office because if MS Office cannot do, then no one office suite can do.

Moreover, many people are used to use the Microsoft Office UI and they do not want to change because OpenOffice. You might argue that between MS Word '97 and MS Word 365, the UI gap is equally wide between MS Word 97 and OpenOffice but - again - people complain about OpenOffice and not because Microsoft Office upgrade.

You should not even have to bribe politicians but just promoting and amplify the vox popouli.

The fault of the EU politics

The EU bureaucracy fault is having provided a norm for which every office suite should be able to export a document in a open-format. Nope.

Every office suite should save and load in a specific open-format documented by e.g. Fraunohoffer Institute or Sorbona University IT department or whatever (can it be LaTeX? Or something better?).

Every office suite should be able to produce PostScript output to print the document and the printed document should be equal to its preview (after all, this is the main goal for an office suite).

Every office suite should be able to produce a compressed size-oriented output for electronic transmission and long-term not-modifiable backup (PDF could be that format as far as Adobe provide full documentation and standardization for free).

When the EU laws will impose these restrictions in order to achieve an true open-data norm, the IT world will be a better place whatever people will use proprietary or open-source office suite.

The HTML is a standard. Otherwise, one of the most interesting and business-like part of Internet the WWW would not have been even existed. Well, to be precise: the HTML is a standard by W3C but many browser render it in a different way and sometimes accept out-of-standard additions. We all know how much pain this have been caused in the past.

After more than 30 years since the invention of Internet (1990, CERN by Berners-Lee) the open-data format is still an utopia. This is the EU fault. The US anti-trust that forced IBM to open the AT standard did a great thing for personal computer evolution and adoption plus created one of the most precious market that lasted for more than a decade (now hardware is a commodity, apart for specific uses).

Politics is for society, not for technology

Whatever you might think. In the new world of information (1990) politics is not anymore a solution, is not anymore an answer, it is just a problem - a big invalidating handicap - because there is nothing to discuss about. The open-data is a strict necessity, only a public entity can provide a standard for a type of data (word, excel, powerpoint, etc.) like HTML and W3C or EtherCat by Fraunoffer Institute, etc.

As you can see, there is nothing that politics can decide because everything is out of their competence, out of their duty and out of their control but they have a great interest in IT because money which means sponsorship in the best case and bribing in the worst.

We need to understand this, and cut them off completely. Yes, many people here that cannot write code or design an open-standard will be cut out any decision and every participation.

Politics call this: digital gap. The correct term is digital handicap. Fix you handicap and came with us hiking the mountain. You cannot ask IT guys to bring down the mountain to let you jump on top of it. About the sidewalks, is fair and even a social obligation to raised down the steps to let people with a kind of handicap being independent. Not for mountains.

Politics is about society. Not about technology. It can be useful for the society, it is a damn damage for the technology. You might argue that technology can affect society. Yes, it is right, this is the reason because politics is in charge to enforce standards - not to develop or decide which standards.


(*) They are not incompetent, at least not in general. The Italians are almost also incompetent but it a rarity rather than a common characteristics. It depends by the fact that Italy has just only 20% of population with a bachelor degree (or better) compared to 40+% of other countries - and with such a low percentage of highly-educated voters - being incompetent is something like being “one of us” for 80% of the italian voters.


This is interesting:
jolla to fill qt’s “gap” in the embedded world (whatever “gap” is meant for here, the target audience is completely different between the two)?
Probably not with Silica, as that is an application; verticalizing to a single form is quite a reduction of the potential of qt ?
With Mer? But mer is opensource; why would qt need jolla for using it?

Learn how to troll. Cherry-piking is so basic tactic that it is called boomerang, nowadays.

About licensing and pricing

Yes, considering the questions raised, it is interesting the lack of knowledge about embedded systems, automotive market and their needs. However, I am not surprised at all. I know it since a way time before.


Just to explain the reason behind such - obvious - consideration above:

  • imagine to deal with a system that crashes 1 time ever 1 million runs. It would be nice to have it in smartphone market, it would be great. I wish SFOS would be so stable.

  • imagine to deliver 10 million cars and each of them is used on average 100 times per year. The number of runs is 1 billion and the number of fault is 1000 per year with 1:1M fault rate. Probably acceptable for an infotainment system.

However, (a) the fault rate 1:1M seems quite an utopia here and moreover the automotive industry requires (b) strict coding rules otherwise the whole system cannot be approved under that market standards.

Hence, even imagine to being able to achieve (a) and it would not be easy at all without paid skilled people who are supervising directly the community code production and made some tests before accepting external contributes, the (b) cannot be met by a community of hobbyist coders.

Even a professional developer, would not fit the with the strict requirements and therefore s/he would be just an hobbyist under this PoV. Without specific tools for inspecting and checking the code, I should consider myself an hobbyist coder in terms of automotive market.

Therefore, the SFOS community worth nothing in terms of automotive market because the coding requirements are too strict and certifications are required even if the fault ratio would be met. Moreover, this is just the peak of the iceberg.

There are many others aspect like SLA or long-term support, which cannot fit with a community in general and like this in particular. The bazaar model can do miracles but it is not a magic wand or a general solution for every kind of product or market.

The misconceptions about the bazaar model, about the community meaning, etc. are almost as wide as those about HR or quality vs performance or leadership mantras. Everyone wish to find the magic wand but many just put together words without even knowing the fundamentals behind (or they stick to obsoleted ideas).

A human history turning-point

The most hilarious fact is that while many people are trying to find the magic wand, a lot of others are arguing about who should use it, why and for what. The most iconic example about this attitude is the emerging debates about the AI, usually carried on by people that did not know a bit about that technology.

We are facing a quite interesting turning point in the human history: people who barely are able to use their smartphones (or still writing with CAPSLOCK on) are tricked by Internet “wonderland” to think that they can expressed their opinion about technology and they should be also listen because democracy… :rofl:

The next time you take a flight, tell the pilots that they should undergo for a democratic passengers community deliberation about how to drive the plane. :wink:



Your comment below plus everything you have posted and referenced are perfect illustrations of non-sequitur: get a grip of your arguments already.

What you wrote above this snippet implies that every user must pay a license, and here you are arguing that the license is more tailored for companies, not end-users.

My point (for those who do not get it) is that locking the OS behind a paywall (under the form of a license) to use it means that source code must remain inaccessible so that nobody is capable to circumvent the requirement for, in this case, licenses.

Of course, only the proprietary bits could be licensed (e.g. Silica), but that would render Sailfish no more than a very bare Linux distro that is easily replaceable by the likes of Droidian or even mainline distros (at the cost of features).

EDIT: wanted to add, is there anything stopping companies from currently building their own internal images without owing anything to Jolla? Unless specified in the terms, access to source code for building images makes this plausible.

P.S. stop speculating about the economics of Jolla (or companies in general) with the eyes of a middle-schooler; you are clearly not qualified for this.

Some components in SFOS are open-source and/or software-libre but this does mean that the whole system is open-source or libre.

Almost all Debian installations on laptops are not fit into that case as well. Because they uses some kind of proprietary hardware firmware, usually for the wifi. Which is the reason because Debian decided to deliver their ISO installation with proprietary firmware immediately available.

Moreover, even Richard Stallman never goes so far in saying that a system that uses open-source or free-software should be gratis (free of charge) but just fulfill the copyleft / licensing agreement.

Finally, Jolla Oy is a private company and its goal is to make profits. Hence, why we should be surprised that they deliver some extra functionalities under a not free-of-charge licensing schema?

Sorry, I cannot understand this. I hope my answer above about Debian and free vs gratis will clarify also this point.

Very good advice, keep for yourself in first place.
You need it more than me, clearly! :rofl:

Ignorance about all the topics above and some more others + one reason on the top of all the others:

  • people copy the best not those go broke.

We need to agree that someone should pay for all those advices and teaching I giving here. :wink:

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The more I read robangs posts, the more I wonder.

How come that you don’t have your own big company since you look like you know so much about everything and you are a great leader? At least in your opinion.

For such a talented individual, I can’t understand why you are spending your time in a tiny forum, tiny project, lecturing other people on how great you are.
Time is money, isn’t it?

That’s a genuine question.


Who did say to you, I don’t?

Your interpretation is quite abusing but it is ok, I am mature enough to accept your PoV.

I am interested in understanding how a so great failure happens here and about Jolla Oy included.

Those who took a look at my LinkedIn profile, can clearly understand that Linux, FOSS, etc are my own area of expertise. The SFOS and Jolla Oy failure seems quite a study case to me.

Information are also money.

Technically speaking money (as fiat-currency) is a just a metric (numbers) that can be applied at almost everything or by the opposite to nothing. In fact, some business will never achieve a positive balance whatever the amount of money will be invested in. Or you will never buy love with money (they said).

Finally, I am on holiday. They told me to do something relaxing. More relaxing of this, I get asleep.


Well, i assumed that you don’t have your own because you spent a great amount of time here.
But since you said that you are on holiday and they told you to do something relaxing, I kinda wonder who’s “they” since you are the boss.

Very long vacation though, so I envy you.

As for why jolla is here, it just needs some base level research, business school 101 data analysis and some logical thinking.

If you are hiring though, I would very much like to see your open positions.


If you do not want read books (or memes about books) at least choose wisely the Hollywood’s film to watch:

B: Is he dead?
A: Yes
B: Did you see his corpse?
A: No, I saw him fall down from the train. I suppose he is dead
B: Supposition is the mother of every bullshit! (slap in his face)
B: Check the whole train and found him.
A: Yes sir.

Successfully people have a lot of free time. Slaves have not.

The last time I was on holiday, it was for quite 5 years. Then I got so bored that I was more keen to kill someone rather than continuing travelling around Europe.

I am the one that fire people, not recruiting. My recruiting requirement are too high that I accept everyone that just match a little of them. Come in, show what you can do, then I will decide.

They told me that it does not work in that way because it costs too much. I fired them.

Moreover, I do not have open positions, but a budget. When, I found someone that worth I got him/her and I create a position that s/he can fit enough to not running out of the micro-business associated.

Most of the people who are working for me, do not even know that they are working for me. I do not tollerate yes-wo/men, and firing everyone that behave in that way is not a viable solution.

As you can imagine, it did not happened over a night. I decided at 4 years old my way and I kept it.

Which is the last time you decided something? How long it lasted?

Start asking yourself few questions before challenging others. It would be harder at the beginning but with the time, as easy as eating a pie. Do not even assume that this lesson is for free (free-of-charge) in one way or another, it will come with the bill. Return on the top of this answer and re-read about the cost of supposition.

Your story is nice, but I remember you justifying your presence here as “someone paid me to get of my chair and come here”, in your own words at least with the same context.
So again, what you are saying doesn’t make much sense to me. Maybe you should incorporate a journal in your life so that you won’t forget what you already said in the past. It will come handy in many situations other than that.

As for me, I make decisions every single day, working with insanely great people and all of us driving forward a 5 billion dollar company.
And who knows? Maybe one day I’ll make my own, YellowFishOS and we can become partners!


If they reported this to you, they lied but I am not surprised at all about that. They were supposing to send me here and “keep” my money to fund-raising the elections of the politics behind Volla. It is ended up that a Chinese ship cut the gas pipe and internet cables between Finland and Europe! :face_with_hand_over_mouth:

And this happened because Jappanese deleted completely - as it never existed - a website for hardware support but they did not get the “message” and then the lesson has been repeated, as many times as necessary… :rofl:

BlueFish OS. The blue are the opposite of the red team.

No one told me anything, I’ve seen it with my own eyes.

But anyway, you suggested that I check your LinkedIn.
All I see is freelance and getting out of jobs in 1-11 months. Also no business and being unemployed. Why are you hurting your reputation even more and by yourself?

But anyway. As a self proclaimed successful person I would highly recommend you to get an Xperia 10 III and a license.
Not quite sure why you are still on 10 II while trying to develop for sailfish, and also asked one guy to donate you a 10 III cause “this is the only way to help jolla” (I’ve seen that myself too).


Then you are blind.

I have no time to waste on such ads

Bad reputation is a reputation, after all. (Otherwise? We get angry! :rofl:)

I have already explained that the mark III was not competitive compared to the II. Now, that someone bought a huge stock of them and the price is raised, the III costs as much as the II.

And yes, after some consideration and some pressure, they finally devolved the stock to a bank app but running on Android. Naturally, they pretend to develop also their banking payment network but we know, when Italians are involved MPS (Monte dei Paschi di Siena) model rules. Time to time, it changes the name of the bank but it is the same old story. I know, the situation needs a general solution. We are working on that as well, in parallel. Operation code-name: “Tanto lavoro per Taffo”.

Moreover, the only way to help Jolla Oy is to put an end to theri pathetic business and free all the code.

tldr = too long, didn’t read


Great aggressive wording to start off a post.

Besides, you attacking a post scriptum implies that you have no or very little ground for an argument.

Then you are alone.

There are many barriers between “writing opinions with decency and respect for others” and “literal spam”, all of which have been long crossed.

The “right to write what I think” also applies to me, therefore making the statement of “not having the right to criticize him” a contradiction.

I have solely expressed my POV as a technical user and occasional contributor with regards to forcing users to buy a license to access SFOS, eliminating the need for releasing source code or rendering packages public.
This is my field and will not talk about economics, even though I am being coerced by @robang74 to hop onto a discussion I never intended to initiate and am unwilling to engage in.

Calling others flat-out stupid, without explaining your reasoning, is arrogance and a testament of anti-social behavior.


you are writing imperative, this is not your right. A “please” could change everything.
Also if you want to tell me something write in private - I will flag this post again.

You don’t get it and it is not only you. I am sick of such discussions. PLEASE, stop!

You should learn to respect others opinions. Your arguments are very week, if can be called arguments at all. I don’t even want to talk to you.

The next time, say the magic word and it will be fine.

Just one comment: Being a great fan of one self implies narcissism. Modesty is a virtue, not bigheadedness. Keep on sailing an calm — and modest. :wink:


Here below my expression when I read such a bullsh*t! :blush:


If you are not a fan of yourself, then you cannot ask anybody to be your fan. Moreover, modesty, is something like chastity. It is fine, for about 23h a day. More than that, it for losers. Less than that, it is perversion.

If you think that success is based on be liked by others and you have to “adjust” yourself to fit in their box, be a kitty on Facebook otherwise you are completely wrong as human being and as free mind.

Is it hard to put together all these stuff? Is it contradictory? Three quick answers to pave the question:

  1. every day, do something that makes you proud of yourself, miss a day and it is a day lost or it is Sunday
  2. white or black? gray shades? rainbow? No one just right answer, each time has its own color
  3. balance is the key, perfection can be a far away destination, an inspiring path and nothing more

Be kind with yourself and with us as well: do dirty things like practicing masochism and modesty without bothering me or others about we should doing the same. :wink:

The balance explained by the ying-and-yang symbol.

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