Support for official Fairphone 3+ port - FairSail -

Devices
#21

I think two questions are mixing.

  1. Do we need one sustainable device we can rely on for years?
    Yes. We do and we can select one to push for hw updates if necessary (how many people uses SFos?)

1a. Why Jolla choose Sony instead of Fairphone?
Because SFos users are more interested in performance than in reuse+repair.

Personal experience: I managed to find a stability only when I switched to Xperia X, due to the hw limitations of Jolla 1
The final turn that allowed me to leave android support entirely is the latest browser update.
My plans are to stay with xperia x until network will permit it

2 Likes
#22

I doubt if Jolla wants to try it again with Fairphone, yet we can make a request. Surely Steve is right that coöperation with a small business that has similar ideas would be a good thing. Who else could be a candidate? I also have a Gigaset290 with /e/, just out of curiosity. Same device as Vollaphone.The device doesn’t have such a good sound and camera as the XA2, but everything works snappier and more reliable than my Sony with Sailfish. Without sim the satnav MagicEarth works fine on the Gigaset.
Waiting for a new spirit in the Jolla team.

#23

Manufacturers who sell in the EU and other aligned markets will also be affected by the new EU ‘Right to Repair’ legislation, so I have no doubt greater sustainability and repairability will become not only a legal requirement but also a selling point to push that manufacturer’s environmental credentials. This approach would not be a bad one for Jolla if they could get in on the game early enough to become a ‘known leader’ in the field (yes, I know this is not going to happen!).

1 Like
#24

Would the performance on the FairPhone be that much worse than Xperia ? Camera maybe but the camera performance is still mediocre at best at the moment.

1 Like
#25

I would never, ever buy this sony xa2 for android, but i must now - to have a running SailfishOS on the phone. After a while i compiled a lot of native stuff on the phone, but i need also the aliendalvik. The Fairphone is more expensive, i do not know, if people care about? I can only talk to myself, but a working Sailfish-phone with changeable battery and waterproof sounds like dream.

1 Like
#26

I’m sorry if my replies tipped people off in the wrong way.
The discussions seems to be headed now into a direction with more signal than noise, I will stay out of this now :slight_smile:

I did mostly respond to the emotional frustrations in the initial post. I do see an endless stream of people posting here with all their frustrations, and I just don’t understand all that noise. Though I can understand it if someone is new here and doesn’t know much better.
Really, people pay 50 Euro for a software license, and think they get to tell how a multi-million dollar company has to be steered. It just doesn’t work that way. And there is too much of this toxicity in the Linux community.

I will stay out of this topic now.

4 Likes
#27

No need to apologise, perhaps my initial post concentrated too much on the negatives but really I want to get to a point of positives.
I want SF to work and be a viable option,I would not be here on my 3rd licence (I break phones!) if I did not.
I think it should be OK to be constructive and be able ask why we are in this situation with so many frustrated users and perhaps to me a narrowing outlook.

I think you are right in saying that ‘who am I to give direction to the company’ and it sounds so simple to just use Fairphone. The real reasons and the details are of course more complicated.

Maybe if I rephrased my initial post:

  • How can Jolla get to a long term stable hardware base. It feels like the ever changing Xperia X direction is introducing alot of bugs an ruining the user experience whilst adding more work to a limited development team.
    Would Fairphone which has a longer term more stable hardware support be a more viable option for full Sailfish + Alien Dalvik ?
  • Do we know why this is not the case ?
  • Do we thing this is a better direction ?
  • If so how do we influence this ?
#28

@not_just_a_username if a community port is enough, take a look here.
mal will also Support FP3 (as you can see later on the thread :smiley:.
But remember no Android support and other foreign licenced Software on the community port!

1 Like
#29

good spot, although a bad name for that thread, many ppl search fairphone forums for fp3 and sfos and cannot find that info!

#30

Hi, as mentioned in an earlier comment I have been working on community port of Sailfish OS for Fairphone 3 and it has almost no known issues but I haven’t yet released it to public. Only some final testing remains to be done but I haven’t had time to do that.

12 Likes
#31

A community port of FPOS is great however I require Dalvik to keep up to date. Banking app, Dutch government “Digid” for all things government related, messaging app (Signal but this has a port in beta). Without these I will need a 2nd phone which is beside the point of this.

#32

There are several discussions/requests e.g. here from community asking Jolla to sell licences to unsupported devices with limited liability? I guess FP ports should be able to use such licence if it ever happen.

3 Likes
#33

So everyone who is posting questions about Sailfish, everyone who shares his/her doubts or frustrations should go to Apple or Google? I don’t believe you are meaning this.This answer neglects the point that not-just-a-username tries to make.

1 Like
#34

You can be certain that all the people who are posting their doubts and frustrations really are Sailfish lovers. Otherwise there would be no reason for them to post at all.
There are not many new users, most of us use Sailfish for years now.
Third: you don’t only pay E50 for a license; with the Jolla strategy you have to buy a new device every two years. That is exactly why the EU wants to change these kind of strategies. For it is a waste of precious materials and it is polluting. Many of those materials are mined by underpaid people, often children. These natural materials are limited. In the future we have to reduce, repair and recycle. Also the Big Two have to do that sooner or later.

9 Likes
#35

Do elaborate! (And especially on how SFOS on FP3 would be different) So the old Android Runtime turned out to be a bit of a dead end, but that seems fixed in newer versions. This is really the only obsolescence i can think of here. Apart from that the Xperia X is perfectly usable, and the XA2 is coming up on 3 years - still very much a first class citizen.

1 Like
#36

In my eyes Fairphone 3 + is the only viable option. EU based, sustainable sourced, modular (remember Jolla 1 ideas), readily available, spare parts, known chipset SD632, easily unlocked boot loader and most importantly long term support on the hardware side .

I wanted to point another interesting option, Pine64’s PinePhone.
On the plus side:

  • It very community-based, everything is unlocked and opensource either out-of-the-box (main chipset) or in the process of being opensourced (modem and wifi), runs on mainline kernel (no need to use Android driver and libhybris interface between, just runs on Torvalds’ vanilla kernel) and thus supports multiple GNU/Linux distos - not only a community port of Sailfish but a bazillion others such as UBTouch, various Plasma Mobile-based ones, etc. (NOTE that not all of them are smartphone oriented), boots from SD (so possible to have additional OS on removable cards in addition to the eMMC).

The mainline kernel is perhaps the most interesting part. It means that instead of needing to depend on a manufacturer to provide BSP (kernel sources + android blobs drivers), and depending on some organisation to make a compatibility layer atop of that (like Jolla’s baseports), any small community can just download the official Linux kernel and compile it for the device. There won’t be a risk of getting stuck on an older kernel like Jolla 1 (Qualcom stopped providing more modern BSP) or Xperia X and XA2 (Jolla would need to rebuild an entirely new baseport from scratch).

On the minus side compared to Fairphone:

  • is not EU based, not fair-sourced materials, modularity is simpler and closer to the original Jolla (pogo pins with I2C enabling backcovers, such as an upcoming Psion-styled keyboard) and to the first Fairphone, rather than the taken-to-the-extreme of later Fariphone 2/3 (multiple modules that can be individually swapped/upgraded), hardware availability in the shop is slow (due to Pine64 being a small company so parts and devices come and go depending on the upstream components providers).

Minus shared with Fairphone:

  • Sailfish OS is a community port, no licensed Sailfish X yet, thus no Alien-Dalvik yet, nor Microsoft Exchange.
3 Likes
#37

I agree, the XA2 and XA2+ still work fine. Therefore I will skip the 10II and wait until a better solution comes.

#38

I would spectualte that @Kea means that well with such a limited audience for Sailfish, a static to narrowing userbase you will sell less user licences each iteration as not everybody upgrades or changes phone. Steady income would require most users whom are on X,XA2 etc to upgrade or replace their phones.

If there was a stable release on a stable hardware platform I would be more willing to pay an annual fee or add-ons if say there was a serious module upgrade on the FairPhone. That feels like a more sustainable marketing direction than the current direction to me also.

For example (made up prices) : Base licence 50E. If in a few years chipset upgrade + 30e fee to fund the software development, a camera upgrade + 5e for SW integration, or higher DPI screen +10e.

I realise this maybe propose a wild direction of pay to use/upgrade software and would garner a wild reaction from some people.

#39

I do not think Jolla is making any money from selling licences, there was in the past a similar discussion, e.g. annual fee, etc. We are just too few to support such scheme in practice, unfortunately.

#40

I like this idea, have suggested it before, with diverse reactions. Really sad that such a nice OS like Sailfish is now a niche OS. It still has potential.