Jolla 2.0: Jolla’s former management purchased Jolla’s business, IP, and software assets from Jolla Oy

General
#21

Frankly, I’d prefer if Jolla does not get mixed up in any of the Blockchain and Cryptocurrency hustle. The entire space has left a bad taste in my mouth over the years, and I truly believe that there can be no good or ethical player in this space. It’s turtles all the way down and, quite frankly, I’d prefer if all of it would stay in its own lane. It’s bad enough that Bitcoin brain has infiltrated places like Bogleheads and traditional investment advice areas on Reddit as something supposedly legitimate, when it’s simply Greater Fool Theory at work.

Seeing this bit about Saarnio does not instill confidence. If the blockchain and crypto bros start to infiltrate the new Jolla and push Sailfish OS into a web3 direction, I may end up bouncing from the project entirely.

Hopefully it doesn’t come to this.

EDIT: To be clear, if any individual wants to engage in the cryptocurrency gamble, that’s their right and I’m not going to tell people what to do with their money. My concern is more around the promotion of all this activity and all the ridiculous hype. I’d prefer if Jolla remains crypto and blockchain agnostic.

7 Likes
#22

Frankly, I’d prefer Jolla not to listen to the community seeing how the whole of community can’t grasp the concept of ‘don’t feed the troll’. The concerns of people who got burned on crypto investments… Meh. Both blockchain and AI still haven’t gotten their killer app, so if that brings money to develop the OS further, lets go. To the moon or whatever, definitely better then ideas like expecting everyone to start paying monthly 10 bucks for… Idk forum membership, or upgrading libxyz from 0.9.1 to 0.9.2, those ideas are ridiculous

10 Likes
#23

Whilst I too have no interest in blockchain/cryptocurrency stuff, it will surely all be effectively optional. My browser, Opera, has all of it plus AI, but it’s all separate DLLs and practically invisible.

It doesn’t sound like Saarnio has any great expectations for the consumer market, but it’s obvious the new user experience sucks even more than it used to. Getting SF with WhatsApp et al and Storeman or Chum preinstalled on phones is a no-brainer. Buy the Xperias in bulk and sell them yourself if need be.

1 Like
#24

If I got the main message right, then the focus is on privacy and continuing the great UX of SFOS. This is fantastic and maybe we get also soon our weather app back in working condition. Look at Volla and their latest Volla X23 it’s sold out now and the reason is that increasingly more people want privacy and no Google-Android/Apple phones at least as private device. I believe Whatsapp et al. shouldn’t be on a SFOS device but it’s your own risk to install it. You could tell your contacts to move on to Signal or Telegram if they haven’t moved there already. I know in Finland and other Scandinavian countries, people think Whatsapp is a must to have but you can perfectly live there without it.

7 Likes
#25

I think Jolla should not make the mistake of big manufacturers and always try to implement new trends (latest shit :grinning:). In the past, it has repeatedly been shown that this is often the wrong path (e.g., the voice assistant hype, constant change of the GUI for fashion reasons, force the user into the cloud.). Google and Apple don’t reinvent the wheel, they just act like they do. With the limited resources that Jolla has, they should focus on their core competence because neither the market nor the users need another Android or iOS copy. Otherwise, they might end up going down the path that Microsoft took with its Windows Phone.

6 Likes
#26

The UI needs a bit of a refresh and corrections/polish and i don’t see it as a bad thing jolla offereing some sort of “cloud services” (for a price). Ie ablility to backup your home and restore or setup a new device using that. Or more storage for people that need it, or some sort of dynamic dns for people that want to use their own cloud, or a vpn service etc.

BUt as i said before SFOS needs a lot of groundwork before all the fancy stuff.

3 Likes
#27

Blockchain and privacy are not compatible so it cannot be all three together.
I will not join any cryptocurrency. What I would like to see from the JollyBoys is a more stable OS, more customer friendly. That means a flashing service like Duval has with his Murena phones, updates with less bugs, and other devices than Sony only. All Sony devices have the same narrow ratio, which means cropped up texts etc.
Personalisation is something I try to avoid and until now that works well. So I am not waiting for personalisation by AI either. To me it seems more important to improve the existing OS rather than dreaming of extravagant features.
Remember we were once promised by Jolla to be able to mirror to tv. That didn’t come. So at our home we still stream with that little box from Apple tv.

1 Like
#28

Yes, and an easier way to import/export contacts saving notes, etc.

#29

All those AI and crypto sh*t - please, Jolla -o’kay, but do make 'em optional. Otherwise I shall be forced to leave…

2 Likes
#30

Very happy about the news!

#31

Fully agree, first deliver a polished and current experience (current esr browser, current qt, etc) stable before stepping into new waters. Call it 4.6 or 5.0, that doesn’t matter, but do it right. Else you are just frustrating the community and they won’t join new products. At least I won’t.

6 Likes
#32

At a rough guess:
70% of smartphone users are interested in SF’s ability to run WhatsApp.
7% are interested in high-level security.

Now that’s not to say Jolla can’t market to that niche on security but Volla’s already there (get App Support on that thing!)
Jolla’s marketing has been non-existent since the days of Marc Dillon.
Also, how credibly can anything with (partial) closed code claim security?

Jolla’s main USP (to consumers) is: the iDroid alternative. The market is potentially around half a billion phones a year but it’s a really hard market to crack and one they’ve failed at repeatedly.

I don’t think Jolla should burn their $10m on consumer marketing. Rather, they should focus on things like the Volla deal and get a decent PR person who’ll promote every release etc. But don’t do it half-arsed. Make sure every ‘pre-installed’ consumer phone comes with App Support, Aurora Store, WhatsApp and Storeman.

1 Like
#33

I agree with your general idea, with some moderating comments:

The 70% of smartphone users (I would say 99%) are those who just want something that works and has access to the usual apps. The <1% who choose SFOS despite unavailability of the usual apps, do so for a reason, and I can think of two of them: 1) better perceived security and 2) absence information leak to Google and Apple. Why would such user profile voluntarily engage into leaking data to Meta? I mean if you must use Whatsapp, it negates the major benefits of SFOS, so why bother with such a niche OS?

I assume it’s only closed to you and me. We hear that government agencies can access the code of MS Windows, so I expect that important Jolla customers were given the same access. If government agencies of Russia have audited the code and Jolla had opportunity to pick up the fixes, this gives credibility.

Ideally, what would solve the closed source issue would be if the community could come up with a port of Phosh or Plasma-mobile working on top of the SFOS base system bypassing most of the closed code. (I have no idea how much doable this is without full cooperation from Jollyboys, feel free to kill my hopes.)

2 Likes
#34

Much of your logic doesn’t follow. Let’s just say that, on Volla, maybe you want a click-to-install version.

But I’m talking about marketing. Why would that 7% you’re talking about bother with SF which has the worst security credentials of privacy-oriented phones?

The answer isn’t that different from what the 93% want.

#35

I finally had a look at Volla to see what the hype’s about - custom hardware (nice) running a modified AOSP-based OS (meh).

Why would you need Android app support for an Android phone?

#36

About Volla phone

It’s a solid midrange device, with 8 core, produced by Gigaset . Product code. The Volla Phone is detected by Sailfish OS as a Gigaset GS290.

Instead

Rephone (Gigaset GS5/Volla22)

On the other side Fairphone and Murena phone 2 (expected to be sold in Q1 2024).

I have been told that Murena phone 2 is based on Fairphone 4 but I did not verified this gossip. This information does not surprise me because the Fairphone is one of the best supported smartphone among those USBport can run on. However, Murena 2 has a Super AMOLED display and physical kill switches like Librem 5 but it is much more powerful, more RAM and internal storage.

Moreover, Fairphone is costly (€600) not because its technology but because its particular eco-friend and fair-trade supply chain. Produced by traditional factories, seems reasonable that the price can drop at €300 [1] which is the same price of the rephone/gigaset/volla22.

[1] Trio Early Bird — €898, Trio Early Bird – get 3 Murena 2 at one of the best prices ever.

Murena Phone 2 Hardware Specs

Even if the SoC appears to be the one from Fairphone 4, cameras and display are better than Fairphone 5 which is nothing else than a more powerful (SoC) version of the 5 with an AMOLED display.

Screenshot from 2023-12-03 15-15-37
Screenshot from 2023-12-03 15-15-37973×865 211 KB

In 2025, when the production costs will come down (scale economy), Murena 2 phone has the chance to be the best hardware and the cheapest privacy-oriented smartphone. Not bad for a six moths crowd raise funding campaign.

2 Likes
#38

It has all 3 OS’s pre-installed? I assumed you got to be able to install them.

I could turn your question around – why install AOSP when you (theoretically) have App Support? :wink:

When the only review I can find mentioning SF sounds disappointed because it doesn’t have App Support on Volla, that’s a major (free) marketing opportunity lost.

#39

I use SFOS cause it’s Linux on a phone. And it runs Android Apps like WINE runs Windows Apps.
That WhatsApp is available and runs well lets me use Sailfish as my daily driver, because people don’t exist in a vacuum and WhatsApp is the default messaging app for pretty much everyone who isn’t American and uses iMessage.

The fact that it’s jailed and has no access to my base system also is positive for me. .

6 Likes
#40

I don’t think so.
But your statement pretty much illustrates the so felt sort of fact that maybe some people are extracting sort of like facts and more or less pretty much exact percentages from a very small data base.

It all is, as @David wrote, a rough guess based on personal and therefore limited experience.

My individual view is, that Whatsapp ia good for nothing but Threema and Signal are pretty important for all Europeans (at least the ones living roughly somehow in my bubble). Google Services and even MicroG are unnecessary. AI is complete and utter bullshit on a telephone. I must know. I don’t have it and I am not going to miss it. :slight_smile:

2 Likes
#41

Simple facts: At least 1/4 of humanity uses it daily. Now your very own socio-economical milieu may be different. If I got rid of WhatsApp, I’d lose contact with quite many people, from my 78 year old dad to the group chat of the food bank I volunteer at to the family chat group, my long time friends, my uncle, nieces, nephews, brother in law etc…
The average person just uses what they know, and their interest in finding the golden goose is rather low, if it comes with too many hurdles. Like installing yet another app just to talk to the guy who cares about his privacy.

2 Likes