Switching to privacy with Linux on Laptops

Since newbies to SFOS are dropping iOS Android smartphones for privacy, they will most likely also drop iOS and Windows for privacy on their laptops. Thanks to @nephros for suggesting starting this new topic due to my hijacking Your primary phone - #114 by nephros

Thoughts on getting started in Linux based on a few types of users?

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Well, to start with, I would suggest to dig-up an old laptop/desktop computer from their basement, and start experimenting on it. Lab-rat style.

It is not THAT difficult nowadays to get on with Linux, most of the things that one will need (if not all for most ppl) can be performed via GUI. Playing around with the lab-rat PC for, say, 30 minutes per day, and DuckDuckGo-ing their questions will make them feel much more comfortable within a few days.
To feel even more comfortable, they can install a virtual machine with a Windows 10 OS in order to use apps that they are used to, until they find the equivalent solution for Linux. As time will go by, they will gradually start spending less and less time on their VM. For me, e.g., it was difficult to part Corel Draw & Corel Photo-Paint, until I decided to sit my butt down and learn InkScape and GIMP. I still have much to learn, but at least I can perform all my tasks there now.

I personally use clean Debian (not derivatives like, e.g., Ubuntu), with a few extras, like WireGuard (ProtonVPN), apparmor, FireFox browser with a privacy oriented config and add-ons (uBlock and CanvasBlocker) and a cooked hosts file. Always installing apps from safe repos, and avoid manually installing packages.

To conclude, although it might SEEM like a giant step and a lot of trouble, it is actually something easily do-able. I did it, and I ain’t no software guru! :grinning_face_with_smiling_eyes:

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I’d recommend something like Nobara to newbies - it’s specifically made with gamers and not tech people in mind. Even if you’re not a gamer you’ll probably appreciate having all the batteries included for a pleasant desktop experience.

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I think the upcoming KDE-Linux is a really promising distro for more “mainstream” users who want a Windows-like UX.

It’s an immutable distro (currently based on Arch, but they are moving to BuildStream, like GNOME OS) developed by KDE devs who are funded by Valve (under TechPaladin). Their idea is to give the best out-of-the-box experience for the average end-user, while also serving as a testing and development OS for KDE.

I’ve been testing the alpha version for a while now, and it’s surprisingly solid.

What surprised me most was how fluid everything feels, from boot-up to daily use. The animations feel much tighter, and the overall system lacks the usual jank found in most distros. It might be the first one to deliver a genuinely polished, out-of-the-box experience.

openSUSE (Slowroll) and Fedora are also solid options. Personally, I avoid recommending obscure custom spin-offs as they’re much more likely to break after a system update, while upstream distributions receive far more thorough testing.

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I personally think that for people who just want a smooth and simple experience, Mint is a good choice as of today. I am not using it myself but know some who like it.

The first thing I would recommend to people thinking about switching is to reflect what programs they really need and if they work on Linux and if not, if their are alternatives.

One can already start with the transition while being still on Windows, too. Many if not most alternative programs also have a Windows version.

If you have an old notebook things are easy. Just install your preferred distro there, no secondary Windows or anything. Play around. If there some stumbling blocks you can still consider emulation or going back.

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I wonder about the topic title - why just Linux on Laptops?

I also use Linux more and more, did my first Linux steps with Ubuntu and stayed there.

Linux Mint is also a solid mainstream option, but it caters mainly to basic desktop usage and older hardware. Because it’s based on Ubuntu LTS, it falls short for gaming or brand-new components. Upgrading the kernel helps, but it doesn’t solve being tied to an outdated software stack, particularly Mesa drivers.

Furthermore, Mint’s small development team means it struggles to keep pace with larger upstream projects. This delay is especially noticeable in Cinnamon’s development, and maintaining their own suite of XApps seems like an unnecessary maintenance burden for a team that size.

I don’t mind them, and I actually prefer Cinnamon over GNOME. I just wish they’d use something other than an LTS base, maybe Debian Testing similar to what TuxedoOS did when they moved away from Ubuntu LTS base, because it caused way more issues than benefits.

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No matter what distro new beginners choose, there is this handy site for finding Windows apps alternatives…
https://alternativeto.net/

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Take a look on MX Linux :wink:

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Using Linux Mint Debian Edition’(LMDE) edition.
As its name says, it is based on Debian (rather than Ubuntu). Back in the time I went LMDE over plain Debian due to easier integration of proprietary bits ( codecs, drivers).
I think Debian softened their stance a bit and maybe it’s no longer a criterion.
Nothing fancy in my usage - no games, etc.
As it just works for me, I sticked with.

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I recall LMDE being discontinued years ago, but it looks like I confused it with them dropping the Debian Testing edition back then.

Anyway, current LMDE being based on Debian Stable makes it even worse for desktop use than Ubuntu LTS… sigh.

I don’t know why people still hold onto the idea that LTS is ideal for a primary desktop, or that “long-term support” automatically means “more stable”—it really doesn’t.

Brodie Robertson covered this well in his video Nobody Understands LTS Linux Distros (discussing Nate Graham’s article Long-term support doesn’t mean what you think).

I’m not saying a full rolling release is inherently more stable either (own trade-offs). There’s a middle ground like standard semi-annual point releases, or something like openSUSE Slowroll …KDE-Linux will have like a half-rolling model, eventually

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For pirvacy and newbie one can consider immutable atomic dist such as fedora kinoite.

It sandboxes everything and gives a android level of permission management. (Android is actually also a immutable Linux, which makes android still much more secure than Sfos till today. Well, by aosp itself. All the vendors loading shit to it is why we like sfos. )

Also since flatpak is the main app distribution method in such system most things are designed for gui.

Being atomic also prevents any update from breaking anything, very important for newbie.

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Opensuse Tumbleweed (with the KDE desktop).

Used it for many years now across a suite of laptops, gaming desktops, HTPC’s, and random other leftover computers.

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Heh, sounds like the Linux operating system I run on my phone…

At any rate, my recommendation would be Debian or Fedora. I have used both - Debian is a bit more stable at the expense of being less cutting edge, but my requirements at the moment favour that.

I wouldn’t bother with Ubuntu or Mint or Zorin or anything else that tries to pander to “new” users - it’s just more stuff on top of the essentials which can make things painful.

Similarly, I wouldn’t bother with Gentoo or Arch or anything like that, even for experienced users. It’s fine if you want to tinker, but I want my computer to just work - hence, Debian.

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my bit old parents are happy with Linux Mint - cinnamon desktop.
They does not gaming at all, but for internet, email, documents, downloading photos from their iPhones and few more basic tasks it is perfect… without installed wine i do not even care if they opening exe files from email :smiley:

btw personaly i like linux mint much more than ubuntu, as i am not fan of snaps, flatpacks…
for noobies i would recommend to check screenshots of Cinnamon or KDE desktops, most people who leaving windows does not like ubuntu default desktop (not sure if it is still named Unity)

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Fedora’s Atomic variants are still maybe a little too ‘beta’ for a new user…
I dont know if its still the case, but last time i checked, Fedora Atomics use to propose the upgrade to the F+2 release if you didnt upgrade to F+1 on time.
But that just didnt actually work on the immutable versions. So the GUI was just unable to upgrade the system anymore, little annoying.

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KDE Discover (KDE app store and upgrade center) have improved tremendously last two years, but I have to admit I have never encountered this situation.

Also don’t this problem exist on all non rolling based distro? (or even windows? can one reall update to windows 11 from windows 7?

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I myself use Debian with GNOME Desktop for everything (Server, Work PC, Gaming PC,…) and could not be more happy. Since 13 years, and counting.

That being said: It’s a stable distro. While that bring the wonders of “it just works, and keeps working”, the base packages will not be based on the newest releases. I’d recommend it for anyone that wants a reliable PC and is not too afraid to learn some linux/terminal basics. Especially if combined with some Flatpaks here and there, as well as the backports kernel, it’s a real powerhouse with minimal system and mental footprint.

For full-on newcommers, that just want a working PC with a polished look-and-feel I’ve had good experiences recommending elementaryOS in the past. It’s a little bit macOS-esque in it’s avoidance of confronting the user with the inner workings of the OS.

I don’t recommend Ubuntu, because snaps are just awful, and Canonical always feels like the Microsoft of consumer Linux to me. Fedora and other redhat-esque distributions are not my cup of tea, can’t say much about them.

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My family uses Devuan with backports enabled and flatpak for some programs and github sources for some very few ones to be up to date.

All those systemd based distros are being prepared to work with new kinds of forced authorization processes which implicates a huge affect on privacy.

None of my family ever missed any apps (none of us is interested in gaming, anyway). And if so, there are apps like heroic and steam, which offer many options for that clientele. :wink:

I am using Linux since version 0.9xx, starting with Distros like SLS and Yggdrasil.

I would never ever recommend a „newbie“ to try to install a VM with Windows in it, but, if a spare PC (mobile or desktop) is available, install only the distro of his/her choice on the bare metal or, if not, boot into a live distro from CD, DVD or USB stick to get familiar with the software. If liked, install it from there. B.t.w. even if one messes up an installation, it doesn’t take much time to reinstall it.

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I’ve converted quite a few people in my Linux crusade over the years; my parents, grandparents, uncles, friends, and even some neighbours.

At first, I tried the basic “safe” choices like Linux Mint and Zorin OS. They were fine for a while but ironically their minimalist approach started becoming an issue. Either the simplified UI limited them and made things more confusing, or they ran into missing features.

That’s why I moved everyone over to KDE, which has worked out best for everyone since it’s far easier to tweak to their specific needs when necessary. The only real challenge was finding the right distro base. After trying Kubuntu, openSUSE, and Fedora (both mutable and atomic variants), I found that Fedora Kinoite works best for general everyday use, while openSUSE Slowroll takes the spot for gaming.

This is why I’m genuinely excited about the upcoming KDE-Linux. It hits exactly what I think a desktop distro should be right out of the box.

In a way, it reminds me of the old Chakra Linux project, which I actually helped maintain back in the day.

The fundamental problem with most major distributions is their primary focus on the server market, which constantly conflicts with desktop needs. Desktop Linux has always lacked a major upstream player that is entirely dedicated to the end-user experience; almost every alternative is either a derivative of those major distros or something like Arch that leaves assembly to the user.

Valve with SteamOS was the first major player to take this on, and it’s been working out great. Even though it’s currently focused on a console-like experience, Valve has heavily hinted that they want SteamOS to work as a full desktop OS once the NVIDIA driver situation is sorted out. On top of that, as I mentioned, they’re actively funding KDE-Linux development.

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