Sigh, I have been waiting 10 years for Jolla to provide a release of SailfishOS, I would not clearly define as a beta release. “And I still can’t know even just if it is going to take one more week or rather another half a year” or multiple years or a another decade or if Jolla will go bankrupt before that without being saved (as it fortunately happened at least twice, i.e. “being saved” in the last minute).
Go use UB ports (ex Ubuntu mobile), PostmarketOS or any other “mobile Linux distribution” (which open source Android distros (AOSP forks) are not): I am pretty sure you will gladly return after a while, despite all shortcomings of SailfishOS and Jolla.
I’d say that it really doesn’t make much sense to discuss it in this manner. It is all about merely getting some information, so there’s really no use in debating about Jolla’s history, comparing it and its OS to others, and so on. Let’s just expect being better informed (why shouldn’t we?), and that’s all.
Why would I want to use them? I’ve never complained about Sailfish OS. I use it because it suits me the most (of all there is to choose from). Which doesn’t mean that I cannot express disappointment with a few things, lack of proper information having always been the most troublesome. Please kindly note that I do not complain about OS quality, I do not incite debates about bugs (even though some of them haven’t been fixed for years), or actually anything else like that. In fact, my only concern is lack of information (and sometimes actually misinformation).
So, please, let’s not exaggerate. Merely insisting that they post some reliable information from time to time, definitely doesn’t do any harm or damage to Jolla, and should not be seen as if it was almost cutting their throats or something. Let’s be serious…
IMO even just a simple topic like e.g. ”Xperia 10 IV / V support update” on the Announcements forum would do its job very well.
You see my profile picture!? It shows the neo freerunner. The goal of the project was to make as much open source as possible (even drivers for chips were open source except for the modem because not available on the market). In the result nothing ever worked reliable (i mean nothing, like phone calls etc.) but the hardware was already by far outdated (gprs while the whole world was on umts for minimum 2 or 3 years).
I came the whole way (starting round about 2007) from motorola linux mobile → neo freerunner → ubuntu phone / touch → Sailfish OS.
Long story short: You will not find a mobile phone with a better compromise of state of the art hardware, reliability, percentage of open source parts, tweakability, android app support etc. etc.
I totally agree with @olf, try an other system (or even distribution)! See you back soon…!
The guys from Jolla are doing a great job. They provided a reliable solution always in the past. Maybe later then announced but they always delivered! And isn’t the expectation and looking forward to next milestone the greatest joy!?
So please let them do their work in a calm social climate with the speed that is suitable for them without rushing them. When the next product is out you’ll have at least 8 years of fun with it so i don’t think a few months should make such a big difference.
And so please stop spaming into this forum as soon as the most little opportunity arises in some thread that they are late. It helps nobody. It puts pressure on them. It makes the usage of this technical forum totally annoying when 40% of the threads you dive into end up with Jollyboys being late. thx
Your rant has literally nothing in common with what I’ve been writing about, i.e. periodically providing short status update about development progress. So guess who’s spamming here.
My guess is you, the guy has posted once in who knows how many months, vs you spamming the same wall of text in any thread that is barely relevant to timing, pls get a grip and don’t spiral this into what actually spam is bs
It does, unfortunately. @Fubo asking you to “please stop spamming this forum as soon as the most little opportunity arises in some thread that they are late.” is well understandable.
If you ever did software development of non-trivial projects, you will know that reaching a certain target almost always takes longer than expected and hence questions as “when is it ready?” must be (or “only can be”) answered with “when its ready”. I dissected that in a bit more detail in another discussion thread where you posed the same complaints.
Actually this approach is much preferable to having a marketing department setting a release date in advance and the software is released in whatever state just to keep the timeline (set for marketing events etc.).
Re-iterating “It is all about merely getting some information”, “Merely insisting that they post some reliable information from time to time” and so on and so forth does not make any sense:
You already stated that there is no alternative to SailfishOS for you, hence you will wait … as long it takes to release installation images for the Xperias 10 IV and 10 V.
You know that these installation images are in the works. What would you gain from status reports regularly telling you exactly that (“we are working on it”)?
Entertainment? Maybe. But status reports do not foster progress by any means, i.e. these installation images are not released any faster by reporting progress or even more so by asking for reports.
“definitely doesn’t do any harm or damage to Jolla”
This is not true: As already pointed out, reporting requires resources to do so. Which slows down the progress you are so eager to see the results of.
Furthermore I cannot see how any detailed information about progress would be helpful for you, as you do not seem to intend to participate in the development process.
And you can watch many aspects of the development process and its progress closely at GitHub, if you want to. Why don’t you?
Last but not least there are more important topics than the release dates of installation images for the Xperias 10 IV and 10 V, at least for me (YMMV).
But I know this is all just rhetoric, from your side and from my side.
What you seem to really want are concise timelines and release dates.
But to name such would really do harm to Jolla, if they cannot keep them, which is very likely in software development as pointed out earlier.
I’m this > < close to believing every time someone moans or bitches about release dates or missed imaginary deadlines, Jolla will push the release back by a day.
The fact you think, that because you paid X amount for the phone, would make you entitled to be notified of the progress is a bit weak imho. I would totally understand, if Jolla had already charged you for the paid version, but in reality you paid Sony, and now you want to hold Jolla somehow responsible for the consequences of your purchase decision, and they would have to cater for you.
Absolutely pathetic. Of which Jolla’s @rainemak giving likes to posts bashing criticism of Jolla’s lack of communication is the best symbol.
Bees don’t waste their time explaining to flies that honey is better than shit, so I won’t, either. Keep this mutual admiration society rolling.
Oh, and one last remark to @olf: If I had such an approach of “it’s ready when it’s ready” to people, I would have never achieved things like Developer Hero award from BlackBerry, Evangelist Award from Nokia, Symbian Affiliate Partner from Symbian Ltd, UIQ Partner from UIQ Technology, and a few less important ones. We simply use different measures.
Oh, how does that relate to your nagging questions for development timelines and release dates, or to the topic of this discussion thread?
I think you are diverging.
Come on, please be a bit more patient and do not blow the release timing for the installation images for Xperia 10 IV and V out of proportion. BTW, I have an Xperia 10 V lying around, too.
I always valued your technical contributions much, because they were always concise and helpful. A stark contrast to this single topic, which makes you go ballistic. So let us return to discussing technical stuff, because this discussion (rsp. “discussing this”) has not been fruitful for anybody AFAICT.
Im in the same shoes. Bought an Xperia IV one year ago. The delay to my understanding is mostly because of them waiting for Sony. I think Jolla is doing a great job so far. They have had some real rough sea to navigate through. (Russia/Ukraine), it set them back for a while. They have handled everything exceptionally well in my opinion considering everything.
Allso there are big powers behind the curtains that dont want open source privacy focused things like Sailfish to succeed or become too popular. One of the tactics they have been known to use is to put paid bad actors to troll the forums with the main goal to create negativity and bad atmosphere.
well, the reason I also started this topic was because there is/was only very little to no information about progress at all. I definitely was afraid SFOS is dead.
That being said, I do not want to see going this topic down the drain because of people bashing each other, although can’t deny that I stand with @wetab73 here- a very least bit of information neither complicates nor delays a release and nothing else he or we said here (I think).
So I can only repeat, single and simple “Work In Progress” (WIP) topic for each device here in the forums would be completely satisfying for me and I assume for almost everyone else as well - and if it is just something like “continue debugging …” or “still waiting for Sony” or whatever like once every week, I guess people would be even happy if happening once a month- and that is definitely not asked to much.
I am using the Xperia 10 V over this weekend as primary driver to get more familiar with the hardware. It is a nice device from hardware perspective. But Sonys implementation of Android is really annoying and gets in my way to use the device efficiently. It is awful how Sonys Android is forcing me to use the device in their intended way, e.g. every third unlock ing during my regular Saturday morning shopping the device refused to unlock via finger print sensor, but insisted on numeric PIN, with the reason to increase security (wtf ???).
I am desperately looking forward to getting Sailfish on the device and repudiate this ugly and annoying Android version.
In Sailfish there are also limitations and shortcomings. But at least with Sailfish the limit to get this solved lies within my own incompetence to code. Feels much better for me: I know that in the end I have more control and just need to grow in my competencies to get things solved. In contrast, in Android I just feel locked out: there is no way to prevent being forced to unlock via numeric PIN every third time or so. And does annoying the user this way increase security? ?
Really annoying when being in a rush
I’m aware about that, but so far only the 2nd part is fully answered and since the most of it is or was rather constructive it seemed useful to keep it open.
I think I will do so once 10 V support is actually existing and available.
I’m very surprised to read from you that Sony Android also is that annoying and dissatisfying. I never had Android running on my Xperia 10’s but immediately flash SFOS on them. What you report leads me to the expectation, that obviously not Jolla but more Sony is responsible for many bugs and limitations. Maybe you can get a used Xperia 10-3 for meantime, as on this device you have also VoLTE and so you are future safe.
I have a Xperia 10 iii in use, and did it exactly as described : flashed Sailfish immediately on it without trying Android on this device.
There are bugs, my device us affected by the ‘no audio’ after GPS use bug, as reported here: No audio after some time, have to reboot - #76 by MeeGo-Junky.
There is the suspicion by some very knowledgeable people on this forum that the underlying Android version before flashing might affect the bugs within Sailfish, therefore, as you said, that in sense some bugs with Sailfish on Sony devices might indeed be rooted by Sony in a way.
Let alone for this reason I am looking forward to test Sailfish on Xperia 10 V, to use it as comparative device
Yes i think the underlying Android affects sailfish os. I also had the audio disappearing bug and after flashing aosp 12 and then sfos it disappeared. And on oneplus 6 with postmarketos gps is only working if one had flashed a specific android version before.
Long story short: You will not find a mobile phone with a better compromise of state of the art hardware, reliability, percentage of open source parts, tweakability, android app support etc. etc.
Please @Fubo and others, consider spreading the word outside this forum. There was a discussion on r/linux this morning (which has ~1.5M users!) and people didn’t know about SFOS or thought it was dead or unusable:
Given that SFOS devices are not sold in the US and MeeGo was killed quite abruptly, I think SFOS has too little visibility and/or is not taken seriously, but it is much more practical than what people think.
