Sailfish: Report of the Situation

Goodmorning everyone,
I want to clarify, first of all, that I was one of “The Frist One” in December 2013: I still have the Jolla 1 and the t-shirt.
Not only that but going from Jolla C, I currently have an Xperia XA2.
I can’t say that I regret using Sailfish all these years and I can’t say that Jolla is incompetent and they did a bad job, indeed!
However, I was reflecting on this: practically 7 and a half years have passed since Sailfish’s debut and the store still lives on unofficial apps (and in some cases, no offense to the creators !, not very functional compared to the Android version), not even Nextcloud, with whom Jolla has started a collaboration, he is thinking about this. Storeman is very good and there are respectable developers, but the speech is more or less the same as the official store. Needless to say, for some (many?) Android apps that don’t work and / or don’t install on AlienDalvik, you need another mobile phone with Android. And after 7 and a half years, a bit of fatigue emerges from always (or almost always) having two cell phones in your pocket.
Of course: compared to my friends (also IT / tech savvy) who have an Andorid cell phone, I have never had problems with digital identity theft, viruses, malware and the like and without a doubt Sailfish is very intuitive and practical to use ( the times when I have used an Andorid mobile for a short time, I have always been amazed at how cumbersome Android can be.
And so, in short: where is Sialfish at? Is there really a concrete hope that it will improve shortly and decisively? And what do you think of my reflections?
Thank you all. :slight_smile:

Renzo

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If by improvement you mean availability of all the hot new cool data mining apps then the answer is no. Big companies don’t care about small players, they just want to be where the users are. This is mainly a problem for banking apps or if you are some sort of content creator where SFOS doesn’t quite cut it.

As for other improvement related to the OS some things are coming (better browser engine) others we don’t know.

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Renzo, I share hardware, wardrobe and opinion with you, but I never had the need to have a second phone with data drain capabilities. There are a few drawbacks, but they are paid back by a great, easy to use OS that only misses some data holes.
Anyway, I also hope for further improvement and rapid closure of the little usability gaps.

Update: I forgot to mention that I mostly look forward to good camera support.

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…and I look hopefully forward to a solution for the VoIP (VoLTE) issue! I also have two phones, one Sony with SFOS and one small old Nokia (no smartphone) for simple talking - but one week battery life.

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What is it with all this negativity nowadays?

If your question is simply “when will you finally solve everything with Sailfish OS?”, i think you can guess the answer. And i don’t mean this with any malice against Jolla, quite the contrary. What, if anything, needs fixing is mostly subjective as things stand.

I too have a “The First One”, and a shirt, and a (declined) invitation to participate at the launch in person. I have never felt the need to carry a Android phone around with me. For most of the time i have (since work provides one for email and such) but i have really never reached for it for private use. It was at risk before the XA2 and updated Android runtime came along, but i survived.

Do you sincerely believe Jolla can actually do much about the situation with “official apps”? In what way do you propose that something could be done about it? Pretty sure they would be all over maintaining a native Spotify client for example, but the problem with first party apps is basically always said first party.

You don’t even seem sure what the issues with the Android are. For me it works just great, admittedly with my limited needs.

I think you are way too vague to get anything resembling a good answer.

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Where you see all this negativity you refer to is a mystery. I have referred to concrete facts which I believe are unequivocal. Just as it is unequivocal that I have never claimed that Sailfish performs badly. There is no doubt that AlienDalvik does not work at 100% and if you have been and are so lucky that you have never found apps that did not work or that the official Store and/or OpenRepos were enough for you, well, I’m really and sincerely happy with it. .
But if you say only and only this, you admit that Sailfish is a product for a privileged few, who do not make use of apps that have not been written specifically in and for Sailfish. Which, I’m afraid Jolla has never wanted or wanted, or to remain a niche product. To those who answer me to use an Android phone then, I answer that it is not what Jolla would like, otherwise why create an Android support? Maybe you are too fond of Sailfish and Jolla, I am too and, for the moment, I do not intend to abandon him, but this affection cannot make us lose sight of reality.
I did not open this discussion to create negativity and/or controversy or to seek answers, but only comparisons and … reassurance on our Sailfish. :stuck_out_tongue:
Then, given my bad English, it may very well be that I didn’t fully understand you, and I apologize for that. :slight_smile:

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Hi Tobi!
Well, I can only be really happy that you never had to have two cell phones! :slight_smile:
As I wrote, I don’t regret it too and I’m happy with Sailfish, I just … I don’t know, maybe I wish it was perfect. :blush: Or that it worked at 101% for what are, after all, my not exaggerated needs.
However, I have faith in our friends from Jolla and I am pleased to see that I am not alone in thinking this way. :slight_smile:

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You read too much in to my comment. I never said everything is perfect.

I find two statements in your initial post, both accurate, but also quite unfair to hold Jolla accountable for. Still trying to do so, and then touting that as a failure, that does constitute being negative.

Lack of first-party apps for big-name services
There is obviously not much to be done (except gaining market share). Isn’t the situation very similar for Linux on the desktop? I ask again; what do you propose can be done about it?

Some Android apps doesn’t work
This falls in three categories:

  • Lack of low-level hardware access, like BT, WiFi, NFC etc, and APIs like VPN configuration.
    This is a limitation in how the adaptation layer is sitting on top of a complete and functioning OS. Maybe some of it could be worked around, but it is a very reasonable limitation. Is this what you are after?

  • Lack of Google Play Services, which some apps require. Amazon, Huawei, AOSP etc. have this same issue. Installing microG takes care of most of it. Do you hold Jolla to a higher standard here?

  • Straight-up bugs, preventing apps from functioning. Haven’t heard of many lately, but here Jolla can of course improve, and they are.

Did i miss some type of issues? And why is it fair to “blame” Jolla for it?
Why not be constructive instead?

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Once again you are placing yourself as the defender of Jolla, when no one (including myself) has blamed or blames Jolla for bugs, especially on the Andorid side. I didn’t state it in my first post, I don’t state it now because I don’t think so. On the contrary, I really believe that they are very good at having created everything they have created, in such a short time and with so few resources!
In Italian it says “stato dell’arte”, or at what point it is, and I have simply photographed the situation of Sailfish and, as mentioned in a couple of previous posts, I am looking for reassurance and answers to my latest questions that, at this period, I do not think you have understood well. It works very well for you:

And, as I said, I’m happy with it, but it’s not like that for everyone. And I am among them. But this does not mean that I feel accused of someone or a bearer of negativity. Using Linux for more than 15 years now, in my humble opinion, the comparison does not hold up, then it depends on the distros you take into consideration. But don’t take my considerations into account: after all I’m little more than a simple user. :wink:

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So if i failed to identify your questions, what are they?
(If you are not concrete, how can you expect any answers)

Well they are written at the end of my first post, more concrete than that …

Okay, so all very vague.
In order to answer if it “improve shortly and decisively”, one needs to agree on what the problems are. I really tried to gather what issues pains you, and the points i found was mostly unfair and partially impossible. But you say i failed to do that… so i still think you could do with a better explanation.

Not really, but if you think so I do not insist further and I apologize if I have been vague, unfair and partially.
Good evening! :wave:

you did describe the solution properly, but what do you expect ?

a lot of bigger players did fail due to lack of apps:

microsoft and nokia
blackbarry

so
option 1) accept that there are few apps and rest is browser or on laptop / pc …
option 2) move to ios / android / aosp android

i do not see any other

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Yes I understand what you are saying and I agree: on closer inspection the giants who have disappeared, Jolla is resisting indeed she is walking, and with merit !, for over 7 years, basically between two giants and that’s it.
You’re probably right: either drink or drown. M; as I wrote in my first post, the times that I have used an Android mobile for more than a day, I have found myself sick, and I do not refer to the habit of always using Sailfish!
I’m sorry: I didn’t think this discussion of mine would be taken so badly!
Take it as a sudden loss of patience. :blush:

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This post is quite interesting and I don’t see negativity in it, but constructive post about what is and what is not possible for Sailfish in the future. I think that it is not only about apps. You can do many things through browser and it is getting better and better with every release. So pinning website versions should be an option soon for most used services.
For me it is reliability of the phone which holds me back from using it as a daily driver. So for me there are two areas for Jolla to focus: bugfixes and browser. The UI is amazing, gestures are simple to use and apps can be replaced by pinned websites (and of course Android support). Progressive web apps could be an option too I think.

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Yes,agreed, modern secure browser is all I need. And possibly better camera support.

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I use SFOS exactly to avoid the big-name services and all the present data mining & ‘big brother’ misery, so I’m very happy that they’re not running on the SFOS phone! In the case I would urgently need some of them for some city parking, city bike sharing or something like that, I really would invest in a 2nd phone running on Android, but I’m happy that I do not…

I am very happy that there is the way to use SFOS for a lot of basic smartphone functions including tethering / mobile access point, so that I can also use my (Linux) laptop everywhere I want to.

Data safety and privacy consciousness and using all this modern big-name services for all and everything is a contradiction in itself, so I’m very very happy that Sailfish exists! Thank you Jolla!

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Thank you that you understand me! :bowing_man:
I think like you too and I really hope to use Sailfish for a long time to come and that it continues to grow!
Yes I also hope that bugfixes and browsers continue to improve. :muscle:

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Quite right! And that’s exactly what friends&family don’t understand: not having ties to “big brothers”.
In this, fully thanks to Jolla, I agree!

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